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  1. #1
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    Default Equipment list requirements

    What is required (if anything) on an equipment list? If the owner doesn't have an equipment list but only a current W&B is it completely legal? I have weighed planes which had no equipment list. I filled out the "equipment list" as the airplane with all installed equipment as of mm/yyyy. I don't see anything in the regs about what detail must be on an equipment list. Obviously it makes future removal and replacement of some components easy as you don't have to determine the weight and arm of the removed unit or the arm of the replacement, but other than that what is the purpose of an equipment list?

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    Good question.
    I am not sure I know the answer, but basically anything delivered with the aircraft should still be installed, or documented removed and a W&B performed. Obvious additions are Avionics and such, but there would be a W&B in the log for those. Also depends on the size and category of the aircraft, a 172 and a Saab 340 will have dramatic differences obviously in the equipment list.
    You never have a second chance, to make a first impression

  3. #3
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    Review FAA-H-8083-30 (Aviation Maintenance Technician Handbook) Chapter 4, pages 4-4 (Empty Weight) and 4-16 (Other Considerations), available online. Hope that helps.
    "Arguing with an inspector is like wrestling with a pig in the mud, after a while you realize the pig enjoys it".

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    Review the AMM weighing procedure and review the SMM as required. Use common sense and you'll be okay

  5. #5
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    To the origional question: Do you work for an airline or repair station working on an airlines aircraft? If so, refer to their GMM and W&B manual.
    "Arguing with an inspector is like wrestling with a pig in the mud, after a while you realize the pig enjoys it".

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    My question was not about how to weigh the plane or how to compute the proper W&B using the TCDS information but rather what items should or must be in the "equipment list"? I asked one of the inspectors at my local FSDO and he didn't really know. His belief was that the contents of the list was undefined but it would be helpful if it contained all of the obvious items on the plane which at some time in the future could be removed or replaced (radios, prop, alternator etc.). When I have weighed a plane which had no equipment list but just the last superseded W&B I have created a very brief list (one item, the whole plane with its attached parts).

  7. #7
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    The FAA inspector is correct and the list is probably more important for larger aircraft, maybe not, smaller aircraft CG is more easily effected by smaller W&B errors.
    I've worked for airlines for over 30 years and they've removed the guesswork and had checklists. You want to make sure all required equipment is installed. Go to
    the FAA website and find the Minimum Equipment List (Master), all that equipment should be installed, and if not, deferred or have documentation in the aircraft
    permanent records of the change, and accounted for in W&B. Then like the FAA inspector said, inspect the airplane for obvious items on the plane which at some
    time in the future could be removed, easily, mostly loose items like coffee thermos, ice chest, tools, manuals and charts, life raft, etc. Did you even look at
    FAA-H-8083-30? The empty weight of an aircraft includes all operating equipment that has a fixed location and is actually installed in the aircraft. It includes the weight of the airframe, powerplant, required equipment, optional or special equipment, fixed ballast, hydraulic fluid, and residual fuel and oil. Residual fuel and oil are the
    fluids that will not normally drain out because they are trapped in the fuel lines, oil lines, and tanks. They must be included in the aircraft’s empty weight. For most aircraft
    certified after 1978, the full capacity of the engine oil system is also included in the empty weight. Information regarding residual fluids in aircraft systems that
    must be included in the empty weight, and whether or not full oil is included, will be indicated in the Aircraft Specifications or Type Certificate Data Sheet.
    Other Considerations Inspect the aircraft to see that all items included in the certificated empty weight are installed in the proper location. Remove items that are not regularly carried in flight. Also look in the baggage compartments to make sure they are empty. Replace all inspection plates, oil and fuel tank caps, junction box covers,
    cowling, doors, emergency exits, and other parts that have been removed. All doors, windows, and sliding canopies should be in their normal flight position.
    Remove excessive dirt, oil, grease, and moisture from
    the aircraft.
    Last edited by GlennAB1; 03-15-2017 at 04:05 AM.
    "Arguing with an inspector is like wrestling with a pig in the mud, after a while you realize the pig enjoys it".

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    Last edited by GlennAB1; 03-15-2017 at 04:12 AM.
    "Arguing with an inspector is like wrestling with a pig in the mud, after a while you realize the pig enjoys it".

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    Very.It did make me start digging.

    14 CFR 2x.29 states (or words to this effect)
    23/25.29 Empty weight and corresponding center of gravity.
    (b) The condition of the airplane at the time of determining empty weight must be one that is well defined and can be easily repeated.
    27/29.29
    (b) The condition of the rotorcraft at the time of determining empty weight must be one that is well defined and can be easily repeated, particularly with respect to the weights of fuel, oil, coolant, and installed equipment.

    Where it gets very interesting is in the certification guidance for each of those parts:
    AC 23-8 has this for 23.29:
    (2) Equipment List. Compliance with 23.29(b) may be accomplished with an equipment list that defines the installed equipment at the time of weighing and the weight, arm, and moment of the equipment.
    25-7C has this for 25.29:
    Empty Weight and Corresponding Center of Gravity - 25.29. [Reserved]
    27-1B has this for 27.29:
    (2) Installed equipment is any FAA-approved equipment attached to the rotorcraft with hardware and, as a result, becomes an integral part of the rotorcraft. The installation or removal of such equipment must be recorded in the aircraft equipment list. Compliance with paragraph (b) of 27.29 is accomplished by the use of an equipment list specifying the installed equipment at the time of weighing and the weight arm and moment of the equipment
    and lastly 29-2C has this for 29.29
    (2) ... paragraph (b) of 29.29 ...

    Interesting indeed. Part 23 says "may", part 25 says "we will get back to you" and 27/29 say "is accomplished". Yes, I know this is all guidance.
    Last edited by mnttech; 03-26-2017 at 08:06 PM.

  10. #10
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    And without a list how do you comply with this?

    "23/25.29 Empty weight and corresponding center of gravity.
    (b) The condition of the airplane at the time of determining empty weight must be one that is well defined and can be easily repeated."
    "Arguing with an inspector is like wrestling with a pig in the mud, after a while you realize the pig enjoys it".

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